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e8 losing home signal on 60-2

Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2018 3:47 pm
by jeff b
Hi guys.
i have set up an E8 on a 2012 Honda J35 v6.
Factory the engine has 60-2 crank trigger wheel and hall effect sensor. The camtrigger wheel s some oddball thing so i haven't bothered with it

Set up on motronic 60-2, wasted spark and batch firing the injectors.
Have got the engine running very well and everything is good........except starting......

Sometimes starts good ans sometimes wont spark, dead, nothing.
While cranking i'm getting an engine speed signal but i think the ECU is not seeing the 2x missing teeth? sometimes the tooth count from last home goes to 57, sometimes higher?

Once the engine starts, it's fine, idles smooth as and revs with no missfiring at all.

I thought it might have been dropping voltage too much while cranking, so checked all wiring and earths, even hooked up a second battery to power ECU while cranking, didn't work.

Now here is the weird part, when it won't start, i get an rpm reading, but no spark, i took one spark plug out to double check my timing light wasn't playing up and the engine fired into life first crank of the starter! (on 5 cylinders) I screwed the plug back in with the engine running and it runs happy as. Then i turn it off and try start again,,,,,nothing! I unplugged the coil,,,,,still nothing. I remove one spark plug....the engine fires right up! This is weird, it doesn't matter which plug i remove, so long as i remove one?

I have ruled out cranking speed. What else could it be? Only thing i could think of is when i pull one plug out, the engine speedy up/slown down slightly and the ECU see's the missing teeth and fires up?

Re: e8 losing home signal on 60-2

Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 12:51 am
by jeff b
OK so no help from anyone on here so far?
I hooked up the Cam angle sensor with one tooth trigger and set trigger option to "60-2 + cam home.
So now I get a spark(cyl 1) at the correct time but instead of sparking again at 360 deg (wasted spark) it lets off another spark at only 120 deg?? then nothing for another 600 deg when cyl 1 sparks again? Weird? It runs sort of on 3 cylinders and backfires a lot. Rubbish.

So I assume the ECU is having trouble with the factory Honda motronic 60-2 trigger wheel and not "seeing" the 2x missing teeth?

So I hook up a 24 tooth evenly spaced trigger wheel on the front crank pulley and also use the cam home trigger. Set trigger to "general multi tooth" 48 teeth (1 engine cycle)
And I get the same weird spark sequence, Cyl 1 sparks at 0 deg, then again at 120 deg instead of 360 deg?? I get a double spark close together, then gap until tdc cyl 1 again.

I haven't changed the firing order or anything else.

Change the triggering setup to 60-2 (no cam home signal) and it sparks as it should, 0, 360 deg. Engine starts and runs fine on all 6 cylinders....most of the time. Every now and then it won't start unless I remove 1 or 2 spark plugs.....getting sick of this.

I have the same E8 ECU running a 4 cylinder Honda L15 engine with the same (I think) factory Honda 60-2 trigger wheel on the crankshaft and it starts and runs fine?

I must be missing something here?

Re: e8 losing home signal on 60-2

Posted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 5:11 am
by BlackBirdSR71
Can you attach your tune to your Post?

Also, do you have the correct Firing order setup?

E8 ECU defaults to an inline firing order of 1-5-3-6-2-4

Honda J35 V6 firing order is 1-4-2-5-3-6

You have to use the " Auto Generate Firing Angles " button under Main Setup> Advanced Setup after changing the Firing order.

Re: e8 losing home signal on 60-2

Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 7:14 pm
by jeff b
I'm not sure how to attach tune file?
The firing order is correct, like i said, the engine runs fine most of the time.
Even if the firing order was wrong, on wasted spark, cyl 1 should fire at 0 and 360 deg. Not 0 and 120 deg?

I have another e8 which i tried and it does exactly the same thing.

I'll get an oscilliscope and make sure i'm getting the right signals from the triggers. The cam wheel does have some holes in it, about 5mm away from the sensor, might be getting more than one cam signal per engine cycle?

I was hoping to just use the 60-2 crank sensor like i have done on my other Honda engine but this ECU is not happy with the 6 cylinder?

Re: e8 losing home signal on 60-2

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:19 am
by JimKden
No instructions on here to attach a tune file, but if it is compressed to a zip file it will upload.

Re: e8 losing home signal on 60-2

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:32 am
by BlackBirdSR71
Take a high resolution picture of that Cam trigger wheel please.

And post your Tune file. You can Zip the file and attach the Zip file as noted.

Or use Drop Box, Google Drive or any of the other Cloud drives ( Your ISP usually has a Cloud file as well ) to upload you Tune File. Then simply post the URl in a reply message.