Elite 1500 for Porsche 944 Turbo?

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Player0
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Elite 1500 for Porsche 944 Turbo?

Postby Player0 » Mon Jan 09, 2017 8:00 am

Hi, I'm leaning towards the Elite 1500 for my 944 Turbo track car. I'm currently using a chipped/piggyback ECU with an aftermarket MAF. I have some questions I'm hoping someone can help answer.

1.) My engine uses hall sensors on the flywheel/starter ring to calculate crank position and engine speed. Will the haltech be able to interface with these sensors, or am I going to need to rig up some different type of crank sensor?

2.) There is a Bosch throttle position sensor on the cable driven throttlebody. Can this be adapted? Or is it better to use a drive by wire system? And if the latter, any recommendations for a pedal install kit?

3.) The Elite 2500 has more knock sensor inputs. I don't think I need any other features, but it seems like the additional knock channels would be advantageous? Or is that overkill?

4.) Are there base maps available for the 944 turbo somewhere?

5.) Is a MAF even needed? Or can I get away with MAP / Air Temp. This would allow me to run a BOV vs recirculating valve.

6.) What other sensors will/should I replace/add?

Really just trying to get a baseline on cost, effort and feasibility.

Player0
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Re: Elite 1500 for Porsche 944 Turbo?

Postby Player0 » Tue Jan 10, 2017 12:07 am

1.) Looks like there are 60-2 crank sensors available for this car that bolt on to the front. So that looks solved.

2.) Looks like there's a bunch of D shaft TPS sensors available that can be adapted.

Oil pressure sensor looks confusing. Not sure what replacements will thread in without an adapter and work with the haltech. Not sure if my existing sensor would be compatible. I'm assuming it would need calibration data, but I don't know how problematic that is.

Bosch knock sensor on the 944 looks compatible.

Not sure if either 944 temperature sensors are compatible or how they would be calibrated. Might be easier to replace with something known if I can get something that threads in.

Air idle control is a 3pin on the 944. Looks reasonable to move to a Bosch 2-pin unit. I see adapters around. Doesn't look like the haltech is going to work with the 3pin directly.

Turbo water temp switch... not even sure what that's used for other than to drive the aux pump. Maybe that just gets it's own relay. Not sure the Haltech needs to care. Need to dig in to that more.

Player0
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Re: Elite 1500 for Porsche 944 Turbo?

Postby Player0 » Tue Jan 10, 2017 12:15 am

I'd like to run sequential injection. Cam position sensors are available. Is this really necessary however?

The crank and cam positions are fixed on this old engine. No variocam. There's some cam advance built in and such but seems like these are just static values I could enter in to the haltech, and it could figure out cylinder events from counting the crank pulses.

Is that not done for some reason? Is it really necessary to use the cam position as well?

I'm assuming the Haltech can drive the LS1 coils w/ ignitor. I'm thinking I'd just pick up four of those and run direct fire rather than wastedspark if I'm bothering with the cam and sequential injection. I'm assuming the haltech can manage this directly without any external efi boxes?

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HaltechMatthew
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Re: Elite 1500 for Porsche 944 Turbo?

Postby HaltechMatthew » Tue Jan 10, 2017 3:10 pm

Yes it can read Hall sensors. They simply output a simple digital on/off pulse.

A cam sensor is needed to sync the engine for sequential operation. Without it the ECU only knows crank sync for 360deg. Unless you have a 2-stroke engine, you wil lneed to know engine position over 720 crank degrees (one cam rotation).

It can drive any type of ignition. LS coils are no problem at all.

Almost all sensors are compatible. Find calibration data may be a bigger challenge.

Player0
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Re: Elite 1500 for Porsche 944 Turbo?

Postby Player0 » Tue Jan 10, 2017 11:31 pm

Thanks Matt, I think I have most of my questions answered now except for two.

1.) Still torn on the 1500 vs 2500 based on the single vs dual knock channels. I really wonder if it's advantageous to have the dual knock channels on a turbocharged application even though the 2500 seems overkill otherwise? Or is it likely that I'd find the 2500's extra channels beneficial as well?

2.) Downloaded the haltech software but still cannot find basemaps for the Porsche 944 turbo. Is there something that can be adapted? Say if I imported from another source?

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HaltechMatthew
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Re: Elite 1500 for Porsche 944 Turbo?

Postby HaltechMatthew » Wed Jan 11, 2017 10:56 am

1) It may be advantageous depending on the engine design, but generally a single sensor will do the job.

2) There are none, but only because it is not a common engine. Perhaps a shop that specialises in Porsche may be able to assist. Even so, the VE system is such that you only need to tell it what you have, grab a timing light and line up the timing, and it will run.

Player0
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Re: Elite 1500 for Porsche 944 Turbo?

Postby Player0 » Wed Jan 11, 2017 12:26 pm

Thanks again for the reply. Yeah, I will be having this car professionally tuned and will reach out to my shop to confirm. I don't expect they'll have a problem with it.

Does the Haltech work with MAF sensors? I think I've seen this option, but it seems most people run speed density. I have a relatively aggressive cam and own a MAF already. Is there a list of what MAF sensors are compatible? Or is it likely that speed density is just going to be the better solution.

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Re: Elite 1500 for Porsche 944 Turbo?

Postby HaltechMatthew » Thu Jan 12, 2017 9:32 am

Yes a MAF can be used. There is a discussion on this in another thread somewhere. Both voltage and frequency MAFs are supported and in most cases the tuner will find the cal through normal tuning. Typically the setup of the flow curve is the tuning process.

Player0
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Re: Elite 1500 for Porsche 944 Turbo?

Postby Player0 » Thu Jan 12, 2017 4:28 pm

Thanks for the great responses. I'm sold.

the_bluester
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Re: Elite 1500 for Porsche 944 Turbo?

Postby the_bluester » Tue Jan 17, 2017 5:49 am

I would not mind expanding on one of the OP's questions. Regarding knock sensors and engine configurations, is there any particular advantage on a longer engine like an inline six (RB20DET) to having two as the OEM ECU did? Of will a single sensor placed centrally do well on one of these?

I assume that if two were use you would "Bank" the engine as cylinders 1-3 and 4-6?

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Re: Elite 1500 for Porsche 944 Turbo?

Postby HaltechMatthew » Tue Jan 17, 2017 10:17 am

You can bank the engine with two sensors, but using two sensors may have just been a limitation on the technology that Nissan used when they designed the ECU back around 1988. Definitely not a new bit of tech.

the_bluester
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Re: Elite 1500 for Porsche 944 Turbo?

Postby the_bluester » Tue Jan 17, 2017 11:26 am

If a single sensor can cover a relatively long inline six like the RB20 properly then it is just wasted money and extra complexity I suppose.


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