Transient Throttle weird

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EvilEvolution8
Posts: 46
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2016 9:37 pm

Transient Throttle weird

Postby EvilEvolution8 » Fri Sep 01, 2017 5:20 am

Hello Guys,
I have an Elite 1500 for my Evo 8 with costum loom.
VE table (aspirated part) is fully tuned up.
Weird behavior with transient throttle with stock map value. Car suffer about lean spot on tip-in then back to target AFR.
Increased about 200% of sync enrichment : can goes lean spot on tip-in...then goes rich...and then back to target AFR!
Seems that the ecu applies the enrichment too late, i using a on-board map with 2mt of vacuum line from inlet manifold to ecu...could be a problem?
Any advice?

Thanks
Best Regards

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HaltechMatthew
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Location: Sydney, Australia
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Re: Transient Throttle weird

Postby HaltechMatthew » Fri Sep 01, 2017 10:14 am

You can try lowering the MAP filtering. If the hose is that long it most likely wont need much, 0 or 1.

EvilEvolution8
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Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2016 9:37 pm

Re: Transient Throttle weird

Postby EvilEvolution8 » Fri Sep 01, 2017 5:26 pm

Perfect Matt! I'll try it! ;)

Thanks

EvilEvolution8
Posts: 46
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2016 9:37 pm

Re: Transient Throttle weird

Postby EvilEvolution8 » Sat Sep 02, 2017 4:11 am

Hi Matt,
I tried with 0 (filter not d-filter) but doesn't change.
I tried with a map on inlet manifold but no luck.
I have stock manifold and tb, COP with denso coil and ASNU 1050cc injectors with resistor pack delete plug.
From datasheet the injectors have 949cc about flow and around 1,22ms at 14v about latency.
Stock turbo with GSC S2 cams.
WBC-1 on board.
This weird behavior is less noticeable with stock injectors with 560cc and 0,6ms of latency.

Can you have some advice?
The car is not driveable...with brutal gear change AFR goes to 26-28....with normal gear change AFR goes to 19-20.

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blakebonkofsky
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Re: Transient Throttle weird

Postby blakebonkofsky » Sat Sep 02, 2017 11:10 am

Have you tried using TPS instead of MAP for the transient throttle? Seems like that would be more responsive...

EvilEvolution8
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Re: Transient Throttle weird

Postby EvilEvolution8 » Sat Sep 02, 2017 5:21 pm

Is already setted with TPS

EvilEvolution8
Posts: 46
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2016 9:37 pm

Re: Transient Throttle weird

Postby EvilEvolution8 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:29 pm

Hello guys....have any other advice ?

Thanks

Hacktacular
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Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2017 5:27 am

Re: Transient Throttle weird

Postby Hacktacular » Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:35 pm

I see this as well but not as lean as described above. Any more advice?

Mobne_s13
Posts: 218
Joined: Sun May 25, 2008 8:56 pm

Re: Transient Throttle weird

Postby Mobne_s13 » Sun Sep 24, 2017 5:28 pm

Is there a guide on how to set transient throttle
Up?

What table axis to run and help ful tips? Mine is also running lean on fast pedal movements. Maybe I can tune it away will give it a go next time out.

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HaltechMatthew
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Re: Transient Throttle weird

Postby HaltechMatthew » Mon Sep 25, 2017 11:05 am

If it is lean, make it richer :roll:

Mobne_s13
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Re: Transient Throttle weird

Postby Mobne_s13 » Tue Sep 26, 2017 3:46 pm

What about the table axis? What is correct there?

EvilEvolution8
Posts: 46
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2016 9:37 pm

Re: Transient Throttle weird

Postby EvilEvolution8 » Tue Sep 26, 2017 5:56 pm

Hi Matt
I think that the problem isn't the Number in the transient throttle table but the responsive of the ECU.
In my case i doubled the values in the table and when i open Wide throttle the afr goes lean and After goes super rich!
Seems like the ECU is slow to detect a fast delta% of throttle and applies the enrichment too late.
Can you help me? In this condition the car is not usable on race track!

Thanks a lot

Mobne_s13
Posts: 218
Joined: Sun May 25, 2008 8:56 pm

Re: Transient Throttle weird

Postby Mobne_s13 » Thu Oct 05, 2017 3:52 am

After some street tuning tonight I got my throttle response way much better, no bogging after changing gears.

I have really much higher numbers then the default table. The numbers on the right are about 140.

The settings are not perfect but it runs good.

EvilEvolution8
Posts: 46
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2016 9:37 pm

Re: Transient Throttle weird

Postby EvilEvolution8 » Thu Oct 12, 2017 2:49 am

glad to hear that.
Unfortunately in my case increase the values in table doesn't have any effect.
Seems like the ecu is slow to detect and apply the enrichment.
I don't know what I can do. The car is not usable and not ready to race...i seriously thinking to change ECU :(
No support by Haltech :(

Spadam9
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Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 11:13 pm

Re: Transient Throttle weird

Postby Spadam9 » Thu Oct 12, 2017 10:57 am

What are your settings for detection time / dead band?

I find that having 0%/sec load rate dead band and a 1ms detection time helps, I also use a 80%/sec2 load acceleration dead band. To offset false trips run a I run low levels dis-enrichment with a 0%/sec load rate dead band and a 0%/sec2 load deceleration dead band and 0ms detection. Basically with this set up the transient trace is always running and response is better but it doesn't linger as when it detects a deceleration of the TPS its stops the enrichment. SD tunes usually run a tiny bit lean on tip in compared to maf tunes, but the feel is good no bog down.

The next step to getting it right is in the DBW dampening (if you have it) and the TPS / MAP sensor filtering. Settings that work for me are in pic. I find the DBW too simple in the Haltech its basically a 2d map with some dampening. The stock ecu has a 4d system, that uses APP vs requested torque and RPM, then requested torque max for RPM table. then the max for each rpm/requested torque % per RPM to determine the resulting TPS (this is way smoother than the simple haltech system). To make it more similar to this I have found that using the engine demand (like a requested torque) and adding dampening through low requested engine demand amounts but then removing all dampening when I request over 40% engine demand. This makes it not feel like a slug when I snap WOT, but makes it smoother at cruise.

The ign correction map needs to have the Y axis changed to transient rate to it only triggers when the rate is above 12% (from the rate table) the X axis is rpm as pre usual.

See pic for details, I hope this helps you.

Kind regards

Spadam
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