Elite 550 Toyota 4AGE 16V No Spark

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Max_Misawa
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Elite 550 Toyota 4AGE 16V No Spark

Postby Max_Misawa » Wed Oct 04, 2017 3:45 pm

I thought I had wired up everything correctly but I am not getting any spark

Only 3 of the 4 wires to the igniter have been hooked up so I am guessing thats what the problem is
The wire that is missing that would be on the stock Toyota engine harness black with a blue stripe
This wire is marked as IGT (ignition trigger?) on the Toyota schematics
I am not sure what wire this would correlate to on the 550 ECU

Thanks in advance

Max

Berto24
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Re: Elite 550 Toyota 4AGE 16V No Spark

Postby Berto24 » Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:45 am

You need to wire the IGT for each coil that is what triggers your coils. IGF is the wire you wont use. Resuming 12V+ wire, IGT wire and ground.

Max_Misawa
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Re: Elite 550 Toyota 4AGE 16V No Spark

Postby Max_Misawa » Thu Oct 05, 2017 3:26 pm

OK I will see if I can move the wire in the connector

It is the stock configuration
stock coil --> dizzy cap --> plug wires

Thanks!

Max

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HaltechMatthew
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Re: Elite 550 Toyota 4AGE 16V No Spark

Postby HaltechMatthew » Thu Oct 05, 2017 3:55 pm

IGT - T for Timed signal. The signal from the ECU to fire it.
IGF - F for Fail signal (never used by aftermarket ECUs)

Also monitor your Engine Limit Method and Function channels. These will tell you if the ECU is not running fuel and/or ignition, and why.

Max_Misawa
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Re: Elite 550 Toyota 4AGE 16V No Spark

Postby Max_Misawa » Mon Oct 09, 2017 1:40 pm

Still no spark after moving the wire over to IGT

Changed the trigger settings as suggested by sales and tech in Ky
Still nada

Is there someone local to San Jose, Ca that can assist?
Thanks

Max_Misawa
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Re: Elite 550 Toyota 4AGE 16V No Spark

Postby Max_Misawa » Tue Oct 24, 2017 10:36 am

I checked the wiring to the dizzy and it all seems to be correct according to the wiring diagrams

I also checked continuity from the dizzy wiring to the ECU at the ECU pins, all looks good

still no RPM signal, still no spark

kinda at a loss at this point

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HaltechMatthew
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Re: Elite 550 Toyota 4AGE 16V No Spark

Postby HaltechMatthew » Wed Oct 25, 2017 3:44 pm

Trigger signal must be correctly setup. You should be seeing Running Full as the Sync Level and State. Of not, then no spark. Sounds like it needs a dealers attention.

Max_Misawa
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Re: Elite 550 Toyota 4AGE 16V No Spark

Postby Max_Misawa » Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:28 am

So here is an update

Used an old school techtronix o scope to try to read the signal but it was very difficult just due to its size
As recommended by tech support I ordered a DSO Nano pocket O scope
I got a fairly accurate reading of the Home and Trigger signals in the car using the DSO after some trial and error

Home and Trigger signals are what to be expected, very small voltage less than 1V peak to peak
even adjusting the home and trigger voltage down to .01V was still not able to get a "full" signal steadily it just flickers

It was suggested that I send in the dizzy to Haltech, I have done so waiting to hear back from them in the next few days

I talked to the only Authorized dealer here in San Jose he said if it isn't a Nissan he wouldn't be of any help
I talked to another local shop but they are booked out for a few weeks before they would be able to do any sort of diagnosis

I reached out to @wiringmotorsport on Instagram since I noticed they had the same setup and got the car running and tuned fairly recently
But I was unable to get any details of what settings they had used
They just kept recommending I call into Haltech AUS and they would get me sorted easily
Unfortunately I can not make international calls on my phone from the USA to AUS

So I am just wondering if there is anyone on this forum at all who have successfully got a an Elite series ECU to run on a 4AGE 16V dizzy?
If so your input would be greatly appreciated

Thanks

elisonmercera
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Re: Elite 550 Toyota 4AGE 16V No Spark

Postby elisonmercera » Tue Nov 07, 2017 7:56 am

Do a search in the forum. You should find some trigger information regarding the 4AGE engine.

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HaltechMatthew
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Re: Elite 550 Toyota 4AGE 16V No Spark

Postby HaltechMatthew » Tue Nov 07, 2017 1:26 pm

You can also attach your map file, and for good measure, a photo of your trigger hardware inside the distributor. Then it is easier to help when we can see which one of the 1000's of numbers is not set correctly.

TTengine
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Re: Elite 550 Toyota 4AGE 16V No Spark

Postby TTengine » Sat Nov 11, 2017 3:19 am

I agree that a picture of what hardware you have in the distributor would be helpful. I have successfully ran one type of dizzy that is available in that engine on a custom EFI install. It was not easy to get running, and even once it was running there was still enough issues that I switched that car to a crank trigger system. My suggestions are based on an assumption that you have never gotten the car to start with a new ECU

1 Check engine limiting functions, Haltech has a great video one checking these. If you are not getting a sync with the settings Haltech help has suggested try #2

2 Increase the cranking speed (easier said than done), the first way I did this was just by removing the spark plugs (make sure the injectors are off) this allowed me to get spark and know the basic setting where correct, the other method I did to get the trigger set up and dialed in was mount the trigger assembly in a drill press to dial in the settings for the Haltech

Max_Misawa
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Re: Elite 550 Toyota 4AGE 16V No Spark

Postby Max_Misawa » Sat Nov 11, 2017 9:17 pm

Elison: Noted, I had searched this forum and google for quite some time, a week or so without finding what I needed

Matthew: I will see about getting some photos posted here in the next day or so, the dizzy has returned back to me but it will be a few days before I can get access to the car

TTengine: Great suggestion about removing the spark plugs.
I have watched about all of the haltech videos on youtube, after many attempts no progress was made unfortunately.
I have had the dizzy hooked up to a drill motor and observed the signals on an older (ancient) O scope I picked up, but it does not have screen capture functions.
I tested it against another dizzy I special ordered from Japan and the signals were identical.
It was then recommended to me to get a DSO nano pocket o scope and test the dizzy on the car, which I did but still with out positive results.
So after a few hours of trial and error at the request of one of the guys at haltech I sent in my dizzy to have them bench test it, and it seems that they have been able to get it sorted!
I think it's just one of those things that is just a few clicks on a laptop, but over the phone its really difficult to get the same results.
Also I am not familiar with any aftermarket software as I am just a hobbyist that usually sticks to stock ecu's.
Anyhow I will post my results here in the next few days, I am feeling very confident that I will be able to get it going now more than ever

Thanks for all the suggestions,

Max

Max_Misawa
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Re: Elite 550 Toyota 4AGE 16V No Spark

Postby Max_Misawa » Sat Nov 18, 2017 1:11 pm

Well no luck fellas
The dizzy tests fine on the bench but not when on the car

I have gone through the settings haltech gave me with no luck
and also tried it again with the specs sent to be by wiring motorsport in AUS

I have went ahead and ordered a crank trigger wheel and pulley from shop out here in California maybe the results will be better :/

Max

Max_Misawa
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Re: Elite 550 Toyota 4AGE 16V No Spark

Postby Max_Misawa » Fri Nov 02, 2018 3:18 pm

Just wanted to post an update

Got the car running and tuned recently
but the Elite 550 and the stock 4AGE distributor just don't work in real world conditions
on the test bench everything tested good

My advice is just to give up on using the stock distributor for an ignition signal
A crank trigger setup will save you a lot of headaches

Max

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HaltechMatthew
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Re: Elite 550 Toyota 4AGE 16V No Spark

Postby HaltechMatthew » Mon Nov 05, 2018 10:36 am

No need to give up unless the distributor is too old and the signal to noise ration of the trigger is too poor. We would see cusotmers with 4AG engines a few times a week for almost 30 years who have them running fine. Just as the reluctors age they do get weaker in their signal outputs and now take a little extra effort to get them to work reliably.


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