Elite950 timing problems

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Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2022 10:58 am

Elite950 timing problems

Postby pass1over » Thu Jan 20, 2022 11:11 am

Recently installed an Elite 950 into my '66 mustang. It's controlling a '91 5.0 motor. Car was running before with a Mass-Flo EFI system before I switched to this ECU. Stock EFI distributor, stock coil.

Problem I'm having is the timing table seems to have no control over actual timing of engine. I have verified TDC multiple times, verified the TDC offset angle multiple times. Car idles fine, but won't go above 2200ish rpm's without backfiring through the intake. The cell values where is idles are 32-34°, but car is actually idling around 28°. If I change the values in the cells, the timing does not change. If I rev the motor, timing almost instantly goes beyond the 40° scale that's on my balancer, while the timing table is not commanding this.

I have checked TDC, TDC offset angle, fuel pressure, fuel filter, spark plugs, proper firing order, plug wires, vacuum leaks, compression test.

Like I said, this engine combo ran fine before swapping ECUs and ditching the MAF, so I don't really think it's mechanical. I am at a loss for what to look at next.

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Joined: Sun May 15, 2011 5:38 pm

Re: Elite950 timing problems

Postby dale_che » Thu Jan 20, 2022 7:24 pm

your ecu is not controlling the timing, the distributer is.. it needs to be locked out and the ecu then wired to control the ignition module

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Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2022 10:58 am

Re: Elite950 timing problems

Postby pass1over » Thu Jan 20, 2022 11:39 pm

Car was wired with the directions and wiring diagram that Haltech provided to me. I wouldn't know any other way to wire it.

PIP wire goes to spot A31 on the ECU harness. SPOUT goes to A3. Both are hooked up. I suspect the car wouldn't even run if they weren't wired correctly.

Very simple install, there's only 22 wires that go to the ECU from the motor, and 8 of those are injectors.

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Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2022 10:58 am

Re: Elite950 timing problems

Postby pass1over » Sat Jan 22, 2022 3:04 am

I found this procedure in another post from almost 10 years ago.

As for all distributor cars, and all Haltech ECU's no matter what the model (including most other brand aftermarket system).

1. Note the timing range the engine will use. Maybe 0deg through to 40deg.
2. Pick halfway and rotate the engine to this position, give or take a degree or two. eg. approx. 20BTDC on Cylinder 1
3. Mark the distributor body exactly under the centre of the distributor cap post for Cylinder 1
4. Remove the distributor cap and rotate the distributor base so that the rotor button points exactly to the mark you placed on the distributor body.
5. Bolt down the distributor and never move it again! You have just phased the distributor correctly.
6. Go online with your ECU.
7. Lock the timing to a value you can read from the crank. 0deg TDC or perhaps some cars have 10BTDC. It does not matter.
8. Start the engine and check the timing with a timing light.
9. Adjust the Trigger Angle value up or down until the timing on the crank matches the timing in the software. If you locked at 10BTDC make sure you have 10BTDC on the crank.
10. Turn the timing lock off. Start tuning and makes lots of HP!

The reason for steps 1 to 5 is to ensure there is no rotor phasing problems inside the distributor. By centring the button midway through the timing curve we ensure the button always faces the correct post and cannot crossfire.
Steps 6-10 make sure the timing matches between the software and the crank.

My distributor is set at TDC, I locked out the dist. to 0° and adjusted my TDC offset angle so it was firing at TDC. Then unlocked the dist. I don't see how advancing base timing on my car 20° will allow the ECU to control the timing now. Until I can get time for a proper tech call, can anyone elaborate?

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Joined: Wed Jan 12, 2011 3:28 am

Re: Elite950 timing problems

Postby JimKden » Sun Jan 23, 2022 1:49 am

On the Haltech Youtube channel there is a video on rotor phasing that may be of help.

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Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2022 10:58 am

Re: Elite950 timing problems

Postby pass1over » Sun Jan 23, 2022 3:51 am

Tried the method I posted and same results.

If I change values in the cells where the car is idling, it doesn't change on the balancer/distributor. I can set the values to 0 and it stays at 35°

I'll look for that video you mentioned. I followed the finding TDC offset angle video, but I'll check that one out too, thank you.

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Joined: Tue May 03, 2022 7:04 am

Re: Elite950 timing problems

Postby zombiestig » Tue May 03, 2022 7:15 am

I am running into a similar issue. (94 5.0 with a 950 and factory ignition )

As for the timing not changing- is the spout connector in the harness there? (if you are running the factory harness) That would lock the timing in the TFI and the car would sill run.

I am curious about the TDC angle for this setup, the HELP section has this little note

TDC Angle

Note: When using a predefined Trigger setup (from the 'Select Trigger System window), then the TDC Angle field will change to TDC Angle Offset. This value is now the offset from the TDC Angle predefined in the Trigger System chosen.

Does that mean we lock set the distributor to the 30 as per all of the instructions and then set the TDC angle as zero in the ECU? The PIP is a "predifined trigger"

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